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 Capitalism vs Socialism

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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Capitalism vs Socialism   Fri 12 Aug 2016, 22:27

First some entries to discuss it tomorrow...
http://www.diffen.com/difference/Capitalism_vs_Socialism
http://keydifferences.com/difference-between-capitalism-and-socialism.html


A third way: Social liberalism?
http://www.newstatesman.com/uk-politics/2010/07/social-liberalism-hobhouse


And difficult to discuss...what's in a name?...
https://www.reddit.com/r/SocialDemocracy/comments/1078y2/social_democracy_or_social_liberalism/


And all good and well, but we live in a global market where national markets are subordoned to the whole of the world market and the leading economies...and you have the banks too, who (I see the persons behind the banks Wink ) by their gambling can disrupt the world economy...and the tax evasion paradises...

Tomorrow my comments...

Kind regards, Paul.
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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: Capitalism vs Socialism   Fri 12 Aug 2016, 22:33

Correction:

I used the invented "subordoned" from the French "subordonner" Wink ...and it has to be "subordinated"...
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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: Capitalism vs Socialism   Sat 13 Aug 2016, 22:26

On a French forum of geopolitics one member said that France politicians couldn't decide anymore about their own country, while they are prisoners of the international markets dictated by the big financial and economic powers. As the example of Greece has showed, when local politicians try to make a policy of their own and the financial markets don't agree, they immediately begin to speculate and for instance Greece had to lend on the international markets at exorbitant intrests, making it even more difficult to come out of the recession. The solution was that Greece had to "march" in the path obliged by the European Monetary Union to receive "cheap" money for reconversion.
But as I see it, there is no plan of solidarity to help Greece in its reconversion to add a more stable industry and job creation?
BTW: I saw an essay from a Flemish economist, who tried to prove that all the aid that was gone to the Walloon region was counterproductive and was in fact not contributing to the relance of the Walloon economy. I suppose the author of the article was a "capitalist" Fleming trying to prove his rightness...In all those highly "political" debates, it is difficult, and even more for a non economist to see if the author is biased or that he indeed is defending honestly a given theme...

All this brings us back to the conclusion that even big countries as the UK and France can't act anymore political on their own, without a broader support of an international community. And that's my question: which will be that international ruler, which will act in the interest of the "nation-states" in difficulties. Can it be that every international authority is up to now always biased by one of its big "players"?
How can we start then as a "nation-state" to act as a politician for the greater welfare of the population of a nation-state? Yes and greater welfare is also a difficult concept as one views it from the Capitalist side, the Socialistic side. Or why not from the "Social Liberal" side...

About the "Social Liberal" side I think that the Dutch "Poldermodel" is close to that concept. A Dutch negociation area, where the "social partners" try to come to an agreement between the "patrons" (the Capitalistic side) and the "workers" (the Socialistic side) with the State (the voted members of the ministry) as negociator. But again with all their goodwill these three parties have nevertheless to reckon with the international markets...and who is the real instigator of those international markets? I really don't know...

Kind regards, Paul.
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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: Capitalism vs Socialism   Sun 14 Aug 2016, 21:28

Thinking what a state as Belgium earns to supply us with the welfare state...
And I am grateful for that...as for instance with my three visits a week to the hospital for each time 4 hours kidney dialysis costs to the state more than 600 Euro (516 British Pound)...if I had to afford it on my own...

But the state has also a huge income from all kind of taxes indirect and direct ones...
To take now the taxes on the wages for instance:
http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/Wages_and_labour_costs

In Belgium they are far the worst of the whole Europe...
http://www.verontrust.be/brievenB11/doc570.htm

From 34.330 Euro a year income a worker comes in the scale of 53.5 % of his wage. Only Sweden is higher...
Average as I see it the netto wage is only some 64% of the brut wage...
And then the cost to the entrepeneur isn't also to minimize...
http://www.jobat.be/nl/artikels/totale-loonkost-vaak-meer-dan-dubbele-van-nettoloon/
For 1.500 a month the entrepreneur pays 2.786 Euro (2.397 BP)
For 2.200 a month the entrepreneur pays 4.962 Euro Euro is 0.86 BP...
For 3.000 a month the entrepreneur pays 7.547 Euro  "      "   "

And then you have still the indirect taxes fuel, cigarettes and all that...succession taxes, donation taxes and so on...
All that is a lot of money and the state has each year nevertheless a negative financial balance...
Perhaps if they start to work more efficient...or to cut in expenses...but cut in something voters are accustomed too is perhaps very difficult?...
And after all the working class has to earn it first before the state can start to collect its taxes...and for that there has to be work...provided by the big entrepreneurs and the class of "free professions" the "small entrepreneurs"...
On the French geopolitical forum that I already mentioned one "forumeur" said at the end we will come in France to Congolese circumstances, where one earner supports the whole extended family and even the rest of the village...

My comments in a following message...

Kind regards, Paul.
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