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Nielsen
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Mon 23 Oct 2017, 11:08

@Temperance wrote:
"... The history bit was indeed very interesting, but the religious discussion - all those extreme evangelical Protestants telling me what I should think - was alarming in the extreme. ..."
" ...King James Bible
So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

A verse from Hosea was added to drive the point home:
 
"Ephraim is a cake not turned."-Hosea 7:8

I think that means I'm half-baked. ..."


Temp,
There's a point where we agree, I think, I don't like extremists of any kind telling me what to think, I'm almost extreme in my loathing of such to a point where I may 'love' mankind but detest its acts.

I shouldn't really comment on the King James Bible as I haven't seen or read it, other than what's been told here. I was raised as a Lutheran evangelical, whatever that means, but if my questioning may mean I'll be spewed as well, so be it.

As to being half-baked, aren't we all at - at least - one point or another?
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Mon 23 Oct 2017, 11:38

Hi Nielsen,

And apparently being "woolly" is not what the criticism of the people in Laodicea was all about anyway - I really wish I had known that last week. Taken out of context it is a horribly distressing couple of verses, but, according to the stuff I've ben reading this morning, it's actually about thinking having lots of money will mean you are OK. Apparently Laodicea was an extremely wealthy place - that was their problem, not being wishy-washy or weak.

How dangerous all this nonsense is - and how destructive to people's genuine longing for a sane and tolerant world.

PS The correct translation of the Greek is vomit. Isn't it an awful image?
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Mon 23 Oct 2017, 12:18

PS

@Nielsen wrote:
I was raised as a Lutheran evangelical, whatever that means...

Well, I was raised a Church of England Protestant, whatever that means - or meant. But I suspect your childhood church and mine are very, very different from what now passes for Christianity.

But I need to give all this a rest. Rant over. I'll go somewhere hot and sunny next holiday - and no religion - although a bit of history would still be nice!
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LadyinRetirement
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Mon 23 Oct 2017, 14:30

Unfortunately extremism in any religion is (says she stating the obvious) not niceunpleasant - though I see Nielsen has addressed something similar above.  At one time in my working life I was the secretary to a pleasant muslim lady lawyer (her family had had to get out of Kenya or Uganda in the 1970s when the tide turned against people whose ancestors came from the Indian subcontinent).  She said - well obviously not in those exact words - that among the people she knew, while they might not have approved of ladies wearing the mini-est of micro-mini skirts and dresses they didn't compel ladies to wear the burkha thingies either. But nowadays all we hear about in the news seems to be the extreme islamists.  If one takes everything from the Old Testament as truth there were (as I'm sure you will be aware) some pretty dodgy things that went down.  Like where there is a dearth of men post-Sodom and Gomorrah, two sisters get their old dad drunk so they can have carnal knowledge of him and become pregnant (the instigators of naughty things often tend to be females in the Old Testament don't they).  And where Abraham goes to get his wife back from Pharoah - I can't remember the exact wording and I can't be fussed to look it up, Pharoah says something like (paraphrasing) "Well you told me she was your sister" and Abraham says (again paraphrasing) "She is but we're not from the same womb" - which indicates that Abraham married his half-sister which is gross.

Temperance, I gave a fairly extensive post (posts) a week or two ago relating to my stumbling across some extreme "truther" YouTube channels (and you know how YouTube "suggests" videos depending on what one last watched).  I was very silly in that I allowed myself to be side-tracked and watched some of them.  As I said a lot about it before I don't want to repeat myself unnecessarily but suffice to note there are some "truther" people who are convinced that most of the celebrities in Hollywood were transgendered shortly after birth because of some plan by an elite guardian group of rich folk controlling the world (perhaps this should be on the Village Idiot thread).  Although it was a lot of nonsense there was scant evidence of human kindness in the comments on those videos, which were made by people claiming to be Christians.  Mind you, if the assertions were true and folk such as the Pussy Cat Dolls pop group are chaps masquerading as chapesses I wouldn't mind knowing who their surgeon was in case I ever needed to get my antique, average-sized boobs upgraded a size* because the surgeon must have been bloomin' brilliant.

* Not that I would - I've seen some TV documentaries about "boob jobs" that have gone wrong (implants leaking, that sort of thing).  A couple of years ago at the British Sign Language class I was then attending, one lady dropped out because she said she couldn't afford to pay for the BSL exam because she was still paying off her breast enhancement operation in instalments.  I thought BSL might be more useful to her than larger boobs but then it was her life (and anyway she'd already had the "boob job" done and was paying retrospectively).
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Wed 25 Oct 2017, 14:10

One of my friends has sent me an email with a quote that is apparently in today's i. I should really put this on the Rave thread, but it was in response to my distress - as mentioned above -  after I was rebuked for being similar to something unpleasant from a Roman aqueduct.


Quote from Bertrand Russell:
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.


PS Not that anyone is in the least bit interested, but here is some info about the water supply at Laodicea which is, as I said above, actually very interesting! I think they got hot water from Hierapolis and nice cold water from Colossae. But when the two were mixed the supply became a funny colour and tasted awful - mineral content or something.


The traditional view has been that the Laodiceans were being criticized for their neutrality or lack of zeal (hence "lukewarm").[6] One problem with this is that Christ’s desire that they be either “cold or hot” implies that both extremes are positive. The traditional view saw “cold” as a negative, the idea apparently being that Jesus either wants the readers to be either zealous (“hot”) for him or completely uncommitted (“cold”), but not middle-of-the-road.[7] An uncommitted stance was thought to pollute the pure representation of the faith and create misconceptions about the church and its ideals.

However, a more recent interpretation has suggested that this metaphor has been drawn from the water supply of the city, which was lukewarm, in contrast to the hot springs at nearby Hierapolis and the cold, pure waters of Colossae.[8] The archaeology shows Laodicea had an aqueduct that probably carried water from hot mineral springs some five miles south, which would have become tepid before entering the city (see main Laodicea article).[9] The imagery of the Laodicean aqueduct suggests not that "hot" is good and "cold" is bad, but that both hot and cold water are useful, whereas lukewarm water is emetic.[7]




PS LiR there is a lot of weird nonsense on tinternet (not all religious either). I'd stick to old clips from "Monty Python" and "Yes, Prime Minister" if I were you!
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Meles meles
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Wed 25 Oct 2017, 14:20

@Temperance wrote:
One of my friends has sent me an email with a quote that is apparently in today's i. I should really put this on the Rave thread, but it was in response to my distress - as mentioned above -  after I was rebuked for being similar to something unpleasant from a Roman aqueduct.


Quote from Bertrand Russell:
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.


Funny should mention that. I was reading something this morning à propos of Brexit, which had a very similar (perhaps even plagiarised) quote, attributed to the German-American writer, Charles Bukowski:

"The problem with the world is that the intelligent people are full of doubts, while the stupid ones are full of confidence."

PS : And I found the Laodicean water information interesting.
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LadyinRetirement
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Fri 03 Nov 2017, 14:01

This isn't so much a rant as my being perplexed by something. It's no secret that I am not averse to a light read now and again and recently I read (and enjoyed) a couple of historical whodunnits by a Scots writer called S G Maclean (who puts her hand up in her notes where she has used made up characters, though she does base her stories on research). But it's not actually the content of her books that I want to mention. As she was a new (to me) writer I looked her up on Google and there was an article in a Scots paper saying that she had written her first novels as "Shona Maclean" (apparently she's Alastair Maclean's niece though she says she doesn't want to hang on to his "coat-tails"). However, her publishing company decided to publish her novels as being by "S G Maclean" because they (should that be 'it' if it is publishing company singular?) thought that having a woman's name on a book as the author might dissuade men from purchasing it. I remember reading a long time ago that the Bronte sisters originally used male (or at least gender-neutral) pen-names when first having their work published because in the nineteenth century it could be deemed iffy for a woman to be a writer. But I would have thought we were past that by the 21st century but seemingly not. I'm not jumping up and down incandescent with rage about it but I was extremely surprised to read that in this day and age a publisher would consider there might be something negative appertaining to a novel being written by a woman.

Though I have heard of men writing under female pseudonyms though I don't know why - unless they are trying to appeal to a female readership.
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Triceratops
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Fri 03 Nov 2017, 14:50

@LadyinRetirement wrote:


Though I have heard of men writing under female pseudonyms though I don't know why - unless they are trying to appeal to a female readership.

The hoax that became a bestseller



Penelope Ashe was, in reality, a group of 24 journalists
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LadyinRetirement
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Sat 04 Nov 2017, 13:44

Temperance said "PS LiR there is a lot of weird nonsense on tinternet (not all religious either). I'd stick to old clips from "Monty Python" and "Yes, Prime Minister" if I were you!"

Oh Temperance, I sometimes watch cat videos (as well as 'how to' videos).

Trike, I had quite forgotten (if it ever registered in my brain) about that hoax. The one that sticks in my mind (which I've already mentioned a while back on another thread) was the chap who started a society for the clothing of indecent animals, wanting to put bras on cows etc (though of course it was a prank) in the late 1950s/early 1960s, some time like that.
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Caro
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Sat 04 Nov 2017, 21:04

LIR, I am sure that men who wrote for Mills and Boon would usually (always?) use female pseudonyms.  But like you, I don't know why a women's name would be shortened to initials on a historical novel.  Have they not heard of Hilary Mantel?  While Hilary can be a male name, today it is usually thought of as a woman's name (as are most male names taken up by women - women change to be more like men, but never vice versa).
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LadyinRetirement
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PostSubject: Edited because there was a 'we' between 'post' and 'feared'   Sat 04 Nov 2017, 22:04

Thanks for your input, Caro.  Yes, there are some names which can be either female or male - like there was Dame Julian of Norwich and more recently names I would have considered male have been used by females.  The actress Cameron Diaz springs to mind.  Maybe the publishing house in question regarding my previous post feared that male readers might think a book by a female writer might tend to be bodice-rippery (is there such a word?).  But female authors (and readers) can find treacly plots as irksome as can the male of the species.


Last edited by LadyinRetirement on Sun 05 Nov 2017, 21:02; edited 1 time in total
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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Sun 05 Nov 2017, 20:47

@LadyinRetirement wrote:
Thanks for your input, Caro.  Yes, there are some names which can be either female or male - like there was Dame Julian of Norwich and more recently names I would have considered male have been used by females.  The actress Cameron Diaz springs to mind.  Maybe the publishing house in question regarding my previous post we feared that male readers might think a book by a female writer might tend to be bodice-rippery (is there such a word?).  But female authors (and readers) can find treacly plots as irksome as can the male of the species.


Yes,  Lady in Retirement, as a fervent reader of English literature in the time (now some 60 years ago, and in that time in Dutch translation) I had many times difficulties whit the names of the authors. You...you English people don't seem to distinguish between male and female first names Wink
With Evelyn Waugh from which I read some four novels I knew it was a man. But overhere it was always female, during my kidney dialysis I had even a nurse Evelyn at my bed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evelyn_Waugh
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evelyn_(name)

The same with Ellery Queen...up to today I thought that it was a woman author...and today I see it were two men...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellery_Queen
http://www.nancy.cc/2012/11/19/ellery-girl-name-or-boy-name/

And what is it now? Is Ellery derived from Hilarius or from Eulaly? I read even today derived from a kind of tree... Wink

Kind regards, Paul.
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Caro
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Sun 05 Nov 2017, 21:39

I always thought Ellery Queen was a conglomerate name, like the publishers or something. 

In English-speaking countries now Evelyn is always a female name (unless maybe it is a family name but I think a boy named Evelyn would quickly change it these days). But many other modern names taken from surnames and originally boys' names have been taken up by parents of daughters, like Cory, Cody, Cooper, Blake, Finlay. Some keep their unisex status, like Lindsay.  But most eventually become exclusively for girls. Now I have noticed the shortened forms of names that used to be exclusively boys are creeping into girls' names, like Charlie, Drew.

Speaking of kidney dialysis, the local Lions are bringing to my place for a photo for the paper a caravan they have set up so people with kidney problems can go on holiday and not have the worry of how they will link up to a dialysis machine.  It replaces a former one made for the purpose 12 years ago.
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Sun 05 Nov 2017, 22:54

@Caro wrote:
I always thought Ellery Queen was a conglomerate name, like the publishers or something. 

In English-speaking countries now Evelyn is always a female name (unless maybe it is a family name but I think a boy named Evelyn would quickly change it these days). But many other modern names taken from surnames and originally boys' names have been taken up by parents of daughters, like Cory, Cody, Cooper, Blake, Finlay. Some keep their unisex status, like Lindsay.  But most eventually become exclusively for girls. Now I have noticed the shortened forms of names that used to be exclusively boys are creeping into girls' names, like Charlie, Drew.

Speaking of kidney dialysis, the local Lions are bringing to my place for a photo for the paper a caravan they have set up so people with kidney problems can go on holiday and not have the worry of how they will link up to a dialysis machine.  It replaces a former one made for the purpose 12 years ago.
Caro,

first of all I have to correct:

"Evelyn Waugh from which I read some four novels" Embarassed  Of course it has to be: from whom. After all those years on the English language messageboards when in a hurry...and if I spoke each day of the year English...I would immediately sense the fault...

And thanks for the comments on the first names both female and male...

"Speaking of kidney dialysis, the local Lions are bringing to my place for a photo for the paper a caravan they have set up so people with kidney problems can go on holiday and not have the worry of how they will link up to a dialysis machine.  It replaces a former one made for the purpose 12 years ago."

If I understand it well it is about the red tape to organize a trip and seek for the local dialysis facilities? In our hospital it was done all by the hospital. For going for instance from Belgium to the sunny Spain. The lady from the bed in front of me did it as an example. In theory I could go to New Zealand as we had some one and a half day between two dialysses (I learned from Nielsen that that propably is the plural). In the weekend even two and a half days, so I have gone once to London and once to Paris without dialysis. We had in our hospital also many visitors from abroad for dialysis. But for the destination with a longer stay and with local dialysis I was a bit afraid of all the red tape, even if it was all arranged by the hospital...and when I was on the transplant list I had to be able to join the transplant center within at most three hours after the call...and that period has only taken three months...what a lucky boy I am...

Kind regards from your friend Paul.
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LadyinRetirement
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Mon 06 Nov 2017, 09:18

Caro, it sounds like people in New Zealand are socially aware (or should I just say 'kind') if they have gone to the trouble of providing a caravan with a dialysis machine to enable people with a kidney problem to go on holiday.

Paul,  I am providing a link to a website giving the meaning of Ellery https://nameberry.com/babyname/Ellery  and there is also a Welsh girls' name Eleri http://www.welshgirlsnames.co.uk/eleri/.  Going back to when I worked for just under 2 years at the Natural History Museum in London, one of my colleagues had a cat called Ellery after a band.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellery_(duo)  .

Thinking of my time at the museum, I may have mentioned before that one of my colleagues got the afternoon off because she finished the book of records she was then currently working on.  However, she didn't go straight home as she usually travelled home with her boyfriend (they lived outside London) and so she had a walk round one of the posh parks in London (I think it was Kensington Gardens - where the Princess Diana memorial is) and she heard a child being called by his mother (or would it likely have been a nanny in that vicinity?) and had to listen twice to check that she had heard correctly.  What she heard was "Come here Oedipus" - why, oh why, oh why, inflict that name on a child.  I know we do have names in Western Europe that we have taken from ancient Greece - Penelope, Daphne etc but somehow bearing in mind how the story of Oedipus in mythology worked out I wouldn't wish it on a child, and I think it might be leaving the child open to teasing by other children.


Last edited by LadyinRetirement on Mon 06 Nov 2017, 16:57; edited 1 time in total
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Mon 06 Nov 2017, 14:09

LiR wrote:
Temperance said "PS LiR there is a lot of weird nonsense on tinternet (not all religious either). I'd stick to old clips from "Monty Python" and "Yes, Prime Minister" if I were you!"

Oh Temperance, I sometimes watch cat videos...



Such viewing is also permitted in moderation, LiR! Smile

I do not watch such videos myself, but I do check out Palmerston's and Larry's tweets fairly regularly. Larry posts a moggy video each weekend for "Happy Caturday" which is often very funny.



EDIT: I decided this afternoon (Tuesday) to delete the rest of this message - see my new thread.


Last edited by Temperance on Tue 07 Nov 2017, 15:26; edited 2 times in total
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Mon 06 Nov 2017, 14:23

Deleted - see above.


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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Mon 06 Nov 2017, 20:14

@LadyinRetirement wrote:
Caro, it sounds like people in New Zealand are socially aware (or should I just say 'kind') if they have gone to the trouble of providing a caravan with a dialysis machine to enable people with a kidney problem to go on holiday.

Paul,  I am providing a link to a website giving the meaning of Ellery https://nameberry.com/babyname/Ellery  and there is also a Welsh girls' name Eleri http://www.welshgirlsnames.co.uk/eleri/.  Going back to when I worked for just under 2 years at the Natural History Museum in London, one of my colleagues had a cat called Ellery after a band.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellery_(duo)  .

Thinking of my time at the museum, I may have mentioned before that one of my colleagues got the afternoon off because she finished the book of records she was then currently working on.  However, she didn't go straight home as she usually travelled home with her boyfriend (they lived outside London) and so she had a walk round one of the posh parks in London (I think it was Kensington Gardens - where the Princess Diana memorial is) and she heard a child being called by his mother (or would it likely have been a nanny in that vicinity?) and had to listen twice to check that she had heard correctly.  What she heard was "Come here Oedipus" - why, oh why, oh why, inflict that name on a child.  I know we do have names in Western Europe that we have taken from ancient Greece - Penelope, Daphne etc but somehow bearing in mind how the story of Oedipus in mythology worked out I wouldn't wish it on a child, and I think it might be leaving the child open to teasing by other children.


Lady, thanks for your always interesting and "entertaining?" (they translate it that way from the Dutch "onderhoudend") replies. I love them that much.

Hmm...Oedipus...I don't know if the general public know that much about all that Greek stuff...I guess they  chosed it for the friendly sound...especially if you pronounce it the ancient Greek way (or at least as we learned it at school)...oydy puss (y)...oydy my sweetie...

Kind regards from an enjoying Paul.
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: The Daily Rant    Sat 11 Nov 2017, 13:44

I'm not voting for Jeremy Corbyn now: he got a history question wrong when watching University Challenge on Celebrity Gogglebox.

“Against which city state did Rome fight the three Punic Wars in the third and second centuries BCE?”


Sparta indeed - what a muppet. Boris would have got it right.

But then again...
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