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 Dress to impress?

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Islanddawn
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sat 16 Nov 2013, 18:10

This article on medieval shoes (of all things) is absolutely fascinating. The points today have nothing on the medieval lot, so long and dangerous were the shoes that Henry IV attempted to regulate the practice. http://www.medievalists.net/2013/10/16/medieval-shoes/

Although, apparently, the fashion is now being re-instated in Mexico.........



And the 15thC Austrian bras I think we have all seen, but these bikini pants? Remarkably similar to today



http://www.medievalists.net/2012/07/17/medieval-lingerie-discovery-in-austria-reveals-what-really-was-worn-under-those-tunics/
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Mon 03 Mar 2014, 04:50

Janet Stephens, a hairdresser with a love of history researches and duplicates historical hair styles using authentic hairdressing tools of the time.  The videos are fascinating, and the amount of research and practice that must go into each recreation is impressive. I suppose a knowledge of hair and tools of the trade would help too.

Recreating the Vestal Seni Crines




And 18th century Papillote curls




For anyone interested, there are many more videos of varying styles on Youtube. Just type Janet Stephens into the search box.
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Mon 03 Mar 2014, 09:32

One for the girls here - a sketch of every dress worn by the Best Actress Academy Award winner since 1929:

http://mashable.com/2014/03/02/oscar-best-actress-gown/

I shall now, with some relish, look for a site that shows the terrible mistakes made by some of the ladies involved in this annual Hollywood ritual. I still gleefully (and rather spitefully) remember Ms Paltrow's pink frock that didn't quite fit and Bjork's Dead Duck creation (which was actually quite a funny send-up of the whole nonsense):






Right, back to the serious stuff now - where's me Plato?  Suspect
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Mon 03 Mar 2014, 09:50

'Tis not just the girls who make strange sartorial choices.

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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sun 30 Mar 2014, 09:58

As would be expected of a Queen, Margaret of Denmark wife of James III of Scotland, had quite an impressive wardrobe. Even so, this seems quite extravagant for the time.

Margaret’s jointure, settled on her with her marriage to the King, was the highest allowed under the law of Scotland. The Lord Treasurer was entrusted with the task of paying the Queen’s expenses and because we have his records from 1473-4, we have a brief glimpse into the everyday life of a Scottish queen consort. The accounts for this year show Margaret spent the vast amount of £757:9:10 on clothing (equivalent to £498,000 today).
The fashion of the time was for women to wear long dresses called kirtles underneath gowns. These gowns were like indoor coats. During the time period of records that we have, Margaret had at least fifteen gowns. Ten of these were in regal colors: six in black, two in purple and two in crimson. Black was used for mourning but was also considered very fashionable. Other colors of her gowns were tawny, brown and blue. The materials varied. Five were velvet, five were damask, two were satin and one was made of silk.
Each gown required three to five ells of fabric. An ell was equivalent to 36”. The gowns had different linings such as cloth, fur, velvet, buckram and silk. In August of 1473, Margaret wore a new black riding gown on pilgrimage after the birth of her first son James. This gown had a velvet collar and trimmings on the sleeves. In the next month she had a gown made of crimson satin that was trimmed with no less than forty grey squirrel skins. Large numbers of grey squirrel furs were purchased in 1474 to line gowns and cloaks and to make collars. She had five new cloaks created all in black. Two of them were lined with the grey fur and two with damask. The documents record that on one occasion the Queen personally bought ermine skins.
We know less about her kirtles but these would have required six or seven ells of material. During the time period of the records she had at least a dozen kirtles crafted. They were black, crimson, green and blue and made of satin, damask, silk and velvet and were usually lined with cloth or satin.
The headdresses worn by the queen were very elaborate and we know one of her “dress bonnets” was lined with crimson satin that had been used for one of her kirtles. There is a record of her buying gloves from a Stirling skinner and she also owned a large ostrich feather, probably used in a headdress. She also owned a “poke of lavender” meaning a small bag, possibly a sachet. Margaret had a royal shoemaker named Hude and some of her shoes had cork heels. The records show she wore black hose and had some white foot socks which she may have worn when riding horses.
One of Margaret’s remarkable outfits was manufactured for her to wear to Parliament in May of 1474. The records show seven ells of red crimson for her long gown were purchased for £31:10/- and another ten ells were needed at a cost of £40. For another gown in the same year, fifteen ells of damask were acquired for £28:10/-. Twice the amount of material was needed for a ceremonial gown due to the long train the occasion demanded. These gowns would have been worn with the Queen’s impressive jewelry.
There is an inventory record which has survived of what Margaret owned when she died at Stirling Castle on July 14, 1486. This record is the first list of jewels belonging to a Scottish Queen. The list includes a crimson belt decorated with gold and braid. She had four other gold belts. She owned two gold chains with one having sixty-one links and another fifty-six links. One of her collars was made of chalcedony which is a translucent or grayish semiprecious stone that is a variety of banded quartz. Hanging from this collar was a pendant in the shape of a filigree pomander. She had a collar made of gold enameled roses. Another collar was set with sixteen rubies and had diamonds and double pearls and was also engraved. The main feature of this collar was eight white enameled swans.

http://www.medievalists.net/2014/03/19/wardrobe-margaret-denmark-queen-scotland/
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sat 07 Jun 2014, 15:43

Why does this make me think of Wallace and Gromit?

The world's oldest trousers, thought to be about 3000 years old, have been found in a grave in northern China. What I want to know is; were they worn low slung to show off the world's oldest underpants? I wonder how often they were recovered from the charity shop bag?

http://www.thehistoryblog.com/archives/30759

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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sat 07 Jun 2014, 18:55

Fascinating how they were constructed, with each leg woven as one piece to exactly the correct size. 

Did people even wear underpants back then ferval? Although with the britches woven from wool, they'd be a bit scratchy without them surely.  Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Mon 09 Jun 2014, 12:55

@Temperance wrote:
One for the girls here - a sketch of every dress worn by the Best Actress Academy Award winner since 1929:

http://mashable.com/2014/03/02/oscar-best-actress-gown/

I shall now, with some relish, look for a site that shows the terrible mistakes made by some of the ladies involved in this annual Hollywood ritual. I still gleefully (and rather spitefully) remember Ms Paltrow's pink frock that didn't quite fit and Bjork's Dead Duck creation (which was actually quite a funny send-up of the whole nonsense):






Right, back to the serious stuff now - where's me Plato?  Suspect
I rather like Bjerk for her quirkiness and, as Temperance rightly says, sending up the whole sometimes silly event.  I'm not saying they don't sometimes get it right.  I thought the Oscars were going to the fiery furnace in a handcart the year somebody announced Olivia Newton-John (of whom I admit I am not a fan so maybe my opinion is biased) as something like [slight paraphrase possible] "the cutest thing to come out of Australia since the koala bear".  A) ONJ was born in the UK though she did go to live in Australia during her childhood B) in my opinion Skippy the Bush Kangaroo was much cuter than ONJ.  Also didn't "Braveheart" win a cartload of Oscars one year - the film in which it was intimated that William Wallace might have made Isabella of France pregnant (at a time when the real Isabella would have been 9 years old).  I know there have been very young mothers but a Princess of France at 9 years old without her chaparone, I think not.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sun 22 Jun 2014, 13:23

I'm not going to say anything more about the "What Eugenie Wore" matter [on the "Royal Bodies" thread], but it made me think about the recent hullabaloo about those cheeky Australians printing a photograph (if I have it right) of a gust of wind blowing the Duchess of Cambridge's dress up and her thereby showing something of an eyeful.  It was mean of them to print it (and I'm not a person who automatically thinks the royal family are in the right just because of the rank they hold), but I thought haute couture designers (does the DoC wear haute couture???] had weights inserted into the hems of dresses and jackets to try and prevent this problem. I don't necessarily want to condemn the DoC to a life of wearing "granny pannies" but I guess her advisers will address the matter for the future, maybe by the weights in the hem route). Sometimes I have seen young women wearing low-slung jeans with thongs underneath who have bent over and have shown more than they meant to.  I have always been too cowardly to say anything like "Sites of London" - which was a coded manner of saying one was showing too much in my youth - in such a case.  Part of me thought it would be decent to let the person know but the other part has thought they might take offence.  A hard one to call..........

Not that I can say I always got things right in my youth.  I once wore red long johns under a green mini dress - not my best ever sartorial choice.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sun 03 Aug 2014, 17:06

@Triceratops wrote:
Have been reading about the Zoot Suit Riots which took place in Los Angeles 70 years ago.

The Zoot Suiters are believed to be one of the first examples of teenage counter-culture in Western society. And neither were the great changes in dress codes which took place in the middle decades of the 20th Century restricted to teenagers. There are others. For example the Zoot Suiters would never have been seen bare-headed outdoors. When did people (men and women) stop wearing hats? Did this begin in the 1940s? And when did the number of people without hats surpass those with hats - the 1950s or the 1960s?
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sun 03 Aug 2014, 21:47

Beware of those who still wear hats - especially when they are driving.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sun 03 Aug 2014, 22:40

People still wore hats to church or into town in my community in the 1950s, maybe even the 1960s.  And most men wore hats when I was young - just the other day I asked my aunt if there was any reason why my father, in contrast, never wore a hat. She though he just didn't like them.  They were all still wearing hats well into the 50s and later.  NZ might have been slower to pick up a new fashion than the British of course.

In Britain recently (Lincoln to be precise) I bought a lovely black and red cloche hat, which I have actually worn a couple of times, though rather self-consciously.  It looks very good (and has been worn to some rave reviews - though also to some doubt, I feel), and if I were better at sending photos I would put one here.  Or perhaps not, my husband taking the photo told me to put my head down, so I have my head down a little and my eyes looking up, giving me an oddly coy look.  Quite 1920s though.  But running round my rural town of 350 wearing a nice hat feels a bit odd.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sun 03 Aug 2014, 23:47

A hat or "substantial fascinator" was de rigeur for ladies in the Royal enclosure at Ascot (not sure they didn't insist on hats last time), apart from that ladies seem to wear hats at weddings and funerals. Other than those of advancing years, few men round here appear hatted - if one discounts (as I do) the base ball cap. Ineluctably base, if not particularly ballish IMO)
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Tue 05 Aug 2014, 21:26

The baseball cap is perhaps the most obvious example of the phenomenon of the wearing of sportswear as leisurewear. This seems to have come in almost on a sliding scale with the disappearance of formal hats and caps. When did teenagers and others in the US begin wearing baseball jackets etc as a fashion statements - the late 1940s or early 1950s? And when did soccer clubs in Europe and South America begin selling replica team shirts as merchandise - the 1970s?

Away from sportswear, when did people first start to wear clothing with writing on? Some people have done so for many decades for purposes of work. For example pictures of crewmen from the Titanic show them wearing pullovers with the words 'White Star Line' embroidered on them. But when did the wearing of lettering begin as a matter of personal choice? For my part I have always refused to act as a free sandwich-board for clothing designers. And often it's not just designers names and logos on clothing. How many people around the world have sported the initials of the University of California, Los Angeles on their person without even being alumni? Then there are political/social etc messages on clothing. I remember being bemused in the mid-1980s by the hoards of people wearing white t-shirts with the words 'Frankie says' printed in big black letters on the front.

Any other examples?
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Fri 08 Aug 2014, 14:27

I don't know about baseball caps, Vizzer, but when I was growing up, my father's generation all wore cloth caps (bunnets, in the local vernacular)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_cap
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Fri 08 Aug 2014, 17:45

Not clothing, but plastic bags. I routinely turn the ones with the names on inside out - I'm not an unpaid sandwich man for Tesda etc.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Fri 08 Aug 2014, 20:46

@Triceratops wrote:
I don't know about baseball caps, Vizzer, but when I was growing up, my father's generation all wore cloth caps (bunnets, in the local vernacular)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_cap

Triceratops,

mine too, but only later. When young he wore a
http://www.dadshats.com/fedoras.html

I am a little bit surprized to see your flat cap in Britain...I thought it was "continental"...but yes even the Turks wore a flat cap due to Ata Turk...
I was intrigued by your "(bunnets, in the local vernacular)" and thought about the French "bonnet" but normally "a hat" is "un chapeau" in French...
http://www.omniprix.com/chapeau-fedora-homme/zzomniprixzB1z0--recherche-html?nxtg=c240a320d11-B5CCC5631FE8FF0E
and "un bonnet" is:
https://www.google.be/search?q=image+d'un+bonnet&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=vCblU9K5GImaygPTxICoAQ&ved=0CB0QsAQ&biw=1200&bih=731

 Kind regards from Paul.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Fri 08 Aug 2014, 21:01

That's it, Trike, but was his a hooker-doon?
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Fri 08 Aug 2014, 22:35

@ferval wrote:
That's it, Trike, but was his a hooker-doon?


Ferval,

you know my week points (places?)...

Had to find it...
http://www.thefullwiki.org/List_of_headgear

"a cloth cap with a peak in Scotland"...
But on the whole internet no picture...
Have the wildest phantasies about it...

Your friend, Paul.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Fri 08 Aug 2014, 22:37

addendum...of course I meant "weak" instead of "week"...
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sat 09 Aug 2014, 03:12

@Vizzer wrote:
The baseball cap is perhaps the most obvious example of the phenomenon of the wearing of sportswear as leisurewear. This seems to have come in almost on a sliding scale with the disappearance of formal hats and caps. When did teenagers and others in the US begin wearing baseball jackets etc as a fashion statements - the late 1940s or early 1950s? And when did soccer clubs in Europe and South America begin selling replica team shirts as merchandise - the 1970s?

Away from sportswear, when did people first start to wear clothing with writing on? Some people have done so for many decades for purposes of work. For example pictures of crewmen from the Titanic show them wearing pullovers with the words 'White Star Line' embroidered on them. But when did the wearing of lettering begin as a matter of personal choice? For my part I have always refused to act as a free sandwich-board for clothing designers. And often it's not just designers names and logos on clothing. How many people around the world have sported the initials of the University of California, Los Angeles on their person without even being alumni? Then there are political/social etc messages on clothing. I remember being bemused in the mid-1980s by the hoards of people wearing white t-shirts with the words 'Frankie says' printed in big black letters on the front.

Any other examples?


Perhaps a bit of a tangent, Vizzer, but back in the day I bought - and wore - a T-shirt with the text, 'No job - No girl - No money - No problem'

I  still have it - somewhere - but it's now almost too thredbare to be worn in public.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sat 09 Aug 2014, 10:22

Paul, a hooker-doon is a flat cap where the fabric of the crown is pulled forward and attached to the stiff brim by a press stud.

While on the subject of headgear, I came across this explanation of 'ten-gallon' in connection to the archetypal cowboy hat: it seems that it derives from sombreros, the fanciest of which were decorated around the crown with rows of gold braid, in Spanish gallon, and the most expensive and flashiest of these could accommodate ten rows.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:01

Ah thanks for that interesting explanation ferval, I thought the 10 gallon referred to how much water a hat could hold for a thristy horse and cowboy..... Embarassed
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sat 09 Aug 2014, 19:59

@ferval wrote:
Paul, a hooker-doon is a flat cap where the fabric of the crown is pulled forward and attached to the stiff brim by a press stud.

While on the subject of headgear, I came across this explanation of 'ten-gallon' in connection to the archetypal cowboy hat: it seems that it derives from sombreros, the fanciest of which were decorated around the crown with rows of gold braid, in Spanish gallon, and the most expensive and flashiest of these could accommodate ten rows.


Ferval,

from the reaction of this man I suppose a hooker-doon is that?
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.631714176862246.1073741835.584319371601727&type=3

I suppose I have seen in the time some flat caps where the fabric of the crown was pulled forward and attached to the stiff brim by a press stud (un pression? een drukknoop?) but that were mostly caps in "imperméable" material against the rain. The ones in cloth (fabric?) were mostly partly sewn together with the stiff brim...

Kind regards, Paul.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Mon 11 Aug 2014, 15:40

@ferval wrote:
That's it, Trike, but was his a hooker-doon?


Ferval, I think so though I'm not 100% sure.

.......................................................................

There is a hat museum in an Stockport mill;

http://www.stockport.gov.uk/services/leisureculture/visitstockport/museumsandgalleries/museumsandgalleries/hatworks/
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Mon 11 Aug 2014, 15:43

And a BBC article about baseball caps from 10 years ago;

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/3660333.stm
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sun 21 Feb 2016, 18:05

Get out the sewing box ladies (gents too if you're handy with a needle) and run up your own copy of the oldest known woven garment, the Tarkhan dress. Actually it looks more like a blouse to me but it seems that the skirt has worn away.



Found in a first dynasty tomb south of Cairo, it has been confirmed now as dating from between 3482-3102 BC (with 95% accuracy), it was made from a tasteful linen with a natural pale grey stripe. It had knife pleated sleeves and bodice and would be just the thing for lunch with the girls.

The pattern and sewing instructions are here:  http://www.ucl.ac.uk/museums/petrie/about/collections/objects/tarkhan-dress
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sun 21 Feb 2016, 19:26

Really easy to make, it wouldn't take long at all. Although maybe for summer wear. Smile

I was looking at this today and being astounded by the hours and hours of hand work that went into decorating fabric, although this is a long time after your example ferval when sewing techniques were more advanced.

http://www.ancient-origins.net/artifacts-other-artifacts/stitching-story-cutwork-embroidery-one-most-luxurious-goods-europe-005346

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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sat 23 Apr 2016, 17:38

The excavation and preservation work have been going on for some time but the exhibition has just opened of the items recovered from a 17th century wreck off the Netherlands. The recovered items include some very well-preserved items of clothing and interestingly it seems fairly certain they belonged to Jean Kerr, Countess of Roxburghe and lady-in-waiting to Charles I's queen, Henrietta Maria. She lost her wardrobe when her ship sank just as she arrived off the Netherlands on a secret mission in 1642.

There's this silk gown:



and this small ornate ladies' bag (an étui):



... plus a cloak, stockings, silk and satin bodices, books (bearing the Stuart crest), bottles of perfume, a comb, a pomander and a silver cup ... as well as more general artifacts from the ship itself.

Popular Archaeology : Royal 17th century wardrobe found in the Wadden Sea

Amazing preservation considering they've all been buried in silt and under the sea for nearly 400 years.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sun 24 Apr 2016, 09:51

An amazing find. I love the bag!
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Sun 24 Apr 2016, 10:17

Here's the lady herself,



Jean Ker(r), Countess of Roxburghe (c.1585-1643).
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Tue 26 Apr 2016, 14:04

Along with MM's interesting thread on masks, the fascination with dressing up continues - in fact in all that we we wear we are proclaiming something. Mao had his people in uniforms to try to make the hive more efficient, I wonder if it did? I have yet to meet someone who was not interesting. Even the dullest have reason to be thus and that is enough to set me wondering with interest.  Genetic engineering may change all of that in time. Choosing the prototypes for it might be rather hard; dressing them for it will not, of course. Many more High street closures will follow. Diversity keeps the economy going.
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PostSubject: Re: Dress to impress?   Fri 16 Dec 2016, 20:24

King Edward VII of Great Britain attempted to prevent the demise of the frock coat and to revive the fashion of wearing knee-breeches with evening dress.
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