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 On this day in history Round One

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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Mon 21 Apr 2014, 17:57

Triceratops,

thank you for the filmreel about von Richthofen.

Coincidentally I saw on ARTE? a documentary, where it was researched that it was not a pilot who shot von Richthofen, but a soldier from the ground...
In fact Sergeant C. B. Popkin of the 24th Australian Machine Gun Company...
Did a quick research and found this:
Who killed von Richthofen?
http://www.journal.forces.gc.ca/vo4/no1/who-qui-eng.asp
And en plus I was so lucky to find again the original documentary in English (Australian English? Wink )...








It's all at the end of the documentary and it is a good example how history writing is never complete and that every day one can find new events that alter the story of before....


Kind regards and with esteem,

Paul.
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nordmann
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 22 Apr 2014, 09:22

Monday, April 22nd 1889 and 50,000 people, some on horseback, some on foot, some in wagons and some even mounted on bicycles, wait behind a starting line for noon to come round. Ahead of them sits two million acres (8,000 square kilometres) of land which, thanks to President Harrison's recent decree, has just been transferred from "Indian" ownership to public allocation and available on a "first come first served" basis for would-be settlers, each entitled to 160 acres if they successfully mark out and stake their claim under the terms of Lincoln's earlier 1862 Homestead Act.



Gunshots fired by cavalry officers at 12 o'clock initiated the mad stampede as this swarm of humanity descended on the prairie, sweeping out in a vast arc over the territory, and this scene of dangerously frenzied bedlam and land-lust has been graphically recreated by Hollywood on several occasions. However Hollywood as usual has sacrificed a little fact for the sake of drama - in reality the majority of participants in this stampede were bee-lining towards plots already marked out for them beforehand and some had even "sneaked" in ahead of the April 22nd noon entry time to occupy and define their stakes with rudimentary fences. The frenzy, if any, was due to the requirement to make sure that one's land boundaries included access to irrigation and enough land suited to immediate arable application.

Remarkably two cities - Oklahoma City and Guthrie - were founded on that day. In the case of Guthrie empty prairie at twelve noon had become a city of 10,000 people by midnight with streets and entire city blocks marked out, business lots assigned and the first municipal authority already in session.


Guthrie, four years later (its modern population is still 10,000)


And in 1890, showing the new blocks already well populated with businesses and residencies
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nordmann
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 22 Apr 2014, 14:45

Here's what a certain 10 year old was putting the finishing touches to on this day in 1828 (see the emroidered sentence near the bottom).

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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 22 Apr 2014, 16:08

Great point that nordmann about the population of Guthrie, Oklahoma being the same in 2014 as it was the day it was founded 125 years ago. Certainly food for thought.
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 23 Apr 2014, 09:54

One of the founders of youtube, Jawed Karim, uploads the very first youtube on the 23rd April 2005, entitled Me at the Zoo, with a run time of 18 seconds;

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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 23 Apr 2014, 11:41

April 23rd 1014 was on Good Friday and witnessed what is generally perceived to be one of the most important battles fought on Irish soil - the Battle of Clontarf, near Dublin.

It is generally accepted that the battle signalled the end of Viking dominion in Ireland though as with almost everything else people think they know about the event this is an over simplification of the actual truth.



The battle did however have a profound effect on political developments over the next centuries, and while every Irish child is taught this from an early age and learns to appreciate the fact as a given, neither they nor their British counterparts understand how its ramifications also helped to shape the course of English, and ultimately British, history too. The battle removed in one fell swoop the warrior elite of a previously potent and volatile alliance of Norsemen based in Dublin, the Isle of Man, the Scottish isles and York, rendering them politically inert almost overnight. This gave the English Vikings of the Danelaw an undisputed claim to being top Norse dogs in the region at a crucial point in England's own history and catapulted their king, Cnut, into an undisputed political prominence which he would later capitalise to good effect and which would enable him eventually to become regent of the entire English realm.  

The death of the Irish high-king Brian Boru during the battle also removed that country's only chance of producing a king who not only had designs on reigning in the style of a European emperor but had been well on the way to attaining his objective - Clontarf should have been the battle that cemented this ambition. But though he "won" it he died in the attempt, along with his son and anyone else who might have assumed his crown without dispute. What followed in its wake therefore was a disintegration back into the very internecine warmongering he had hoped to eliminate. Ireland's consequent failure to present united opposition to aggression from without when it mattered most was to have huge (and some would say disastrous) repercussions in that land for years to come.
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 23 Apr 2014, 14:25

The chance would be a fine thing nordmann. The BBC's schedule, for example, seems to have totally ignored the 1000th anniversary.
One thing which I hadn't appreciated about Brian Boru was how old he was at the time of the Battle of Clontarf - well into his sixties.
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nordmann
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 23 Apr 2014, 14:43

Yes - it has been conjectured that Brian actually hoped to install his son Murchad as high-king once he'd got the unification programme out of the way. It is said that he had made arrangements with the bishop in Cashel to retreat to there as a monk in his old age. Murchad's death in the same battle put paid to that notion too.

It is a shame the BBC are ignoring this thousand year anniversary completely. British people generally have inherited a history in which the role of external influences, often at crucial times, is played down or ignored altogether - reinforcing the notion that Britain has always been more an influencer than an influenced. No proper understanding of England's development between the 9th and 12th centuries can be achieved without a knowledge of what was going on around it, especially in Ireland, Scotland, Norway, Denmark and France. Viewing England "in isolation" during this period simply leaves the student with a load of imponderables regarding motive and conduct of those engaged in acquiring and holding power at this time.

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Meles meles
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Sat 26 Apr 2014, 13:14

26 April 1937  - The Basque city of Guernica was bombed by the Luftwaffe's Condor Legion. The resulting death and destruction inspired Pablo Picasso to produce one of his most famous paintings:

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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Mon 28 Apr 2014, 08:16

28th April 1192 - a new word enters English; "Assassination"



This dapper lad - Conrad de Montferrat - had arrived in the Middle East under somewhat dubious circumstances, even by crusader standards. He made his own way there after possibly having murdered someone back home causing him to flee, or possibly having overplayed his hand in a political squabble regarding succession, kidnapping Holy Roman Emperors, blackmailing the Byzantines (never a good idea) and generally ending up persona non grata back in Piedmont. Once arrived however he proved to be a major thorn in the backside for those European noblemen already in situ and who were merrily carving up the Holy Land into manageable holes (assumedly where it got its name from).

Conrad wasn't backward about being forward and immediately joined in this original production of "Game of Thrones". He'd intended to join up with his dad in St Elias (present day Tyabeh on the Palestinian West Bank) but Saladin had got there first and taken the citadel. Conrad went in search of the remnants of his father's army and found them in Tyre. There he learnt that his old man had been taken hostage by Saladin who was now on his way to liberate the coastal town from its crusader invaders. Conrad did what any self respecting son of the nobility would do in the circumstances - he declared himself regent in Tyre and sent a message to Saladin that he would shoot his father himself if Saladin dared try to use him as a bargaining chip in the siege about to start.

The version of events we have is largely that written by the crusaders themselves so we are obliged to believe that Saladin was actually impressed by such patricidal bravado. In any case we do know that William, the dad, appears to have lived out his few remaining days in Tyre with his son and that Saladin's two sieges failed.

What followed was a few years in which Conrad, along with cousins, in-laws and anyone else prepared to support his claim to overall kingship in the Holy Land, toured around besieging and attacking anything in his way (even places held by fellow crusaders) until, by 1192, he had more or less cemented a pretty strong claim on the title which would be ratified by a vote of the leading nobility. These included Richard of Lionheart, someone who fancied himself in the same role and whose thuggish disregard for chivalry and familial obligations probably surpassed even Conrad's. Conrad reacted in typical fashion - he opened negotiations with Saladin to see if together they could rid themselves of the Lionheart pest and sort out a power-sharing arrangement.

Early in April a convention held in Jersualem unanimously elected Conrad as king over the whole caboodle, much to Richard's consternation and we must assume Saladin's delight. However if Saladin was indeed pleased that he was getting what he wanted through diplomacy what followed next would appear to contradict the assumption.

On the 28th April two Hashshashin, members of a sort of wildcard mercenary outfit mostly operating in Saladin's interests though so wildcard as to be unpredictable, waylaid the yet to be coronated king and stabbed him to death. According to Richard's account Conrad managed to crawl to a nearby church and name the Lionheart as his successor. The Hashshashin leaders claimed that they hadn't authorised the killing but that two of their members had been paid by Richard to carry out the deed. Saladin recorded his own grief at the news.

Yet the "official" (ie. Richard's) version was that Saladin had ordered the "Hashshashination". Some very dubious history and a very new word came into being ...
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Triceratops
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 30 Apr 2014, 10:42

30 April 1863.

During the French intervention in Mexico, a company of 65 officers and men of the French Foreign Legion are surrounded by Mexican forces at Camerone. The Legion refuses to surrender and fights to the last bullet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Camar%C3%B3n





Ever since, 30th April is celebrated by the FFL as Camerone Day
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Triceratops
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Thu 01 May 2014, 09:51

1st May 1840, the world's first adhesive stamp is issued;

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Triceratops
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Thu 01 May 2014, 10:40

1st May 1794, the Battle of Boulou, in Meles' neck of the woods;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Boulou
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Meles meles
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Thu 01 May 2014, 16:36

@Triceratops wrote:
1st May 1794, the Battle of Boulou, in Meles' neck of the woods;

Thanks for that Trike. All the action was indeed around my neck of the woods, some of it just a few miles away. But I'm rather ashamed to admit that I just don't know very much at all about this bit of the Napoleonic Wars, even though it was all fought in and around around towns that I know well. I really must investigate further but that wiki reference is certainly a good start.

The modern A9 autoroute through Le Boulou follows an ancient route between Spain and France that has been used for millenia. Hannibal and his elephants used it, as did Pompey in the Roman Civil War. In the 13th century the French army of Philippe III invaded Aragon via this pass, and then had to ignominiously retreat back by the same route (in rout). And more recently it was the main road north to France for hoards of refugees fleeing the Spanish Civil War, and was then shortly after used by the Resistance as a route to get allied airmen from France into neutral Spain.

It has certainly been a well-used road throughout history. Someone should write a book.

Hmmm, now that's an idea.
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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Thu 01 May 2014, 19:55

Meles meles,

my British-French friend, that I now know for many years...even with Belgian connections...

can it be that it is the Via Domitia?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Via_Domitia
But the French Wiki is more detailed...
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voie_Domitienne
The first "roman road" of the Roman empire...
Detail: how difficult it is to "construct" some decent text overhere...
We always learned about the Roman "heirbanen" in our Dutch language history education..."heirbaan" pointing directly to the "army road". Although it is the right word it doesn't exist in my thick Dutch-English dictionary...perhaps it is too sophisticated for the authors of these dictionaries...

In my opinion "Roman road" don't say that much as "heirbaan, heerbaan, heirweg, heerweg"?
http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heerweg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_roads


And yes, Meles meles your "Via Domitia" is well worth a book...

I was in Nîmes...beautiful Roman city...although many "Maghreb" nowadays along the road... here in Belgium I lived once along the remains of an old Roman road...

Kind regards and with esteem,

Paul.
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nordmann
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 07 May 2014, 10:05

At 2.00pm on May 7th 1915 the Lusitania ocean liner neared the Old Head of Kinsale in Cork en route to Liverpool with 2,000 passengers on board. Lying in wait was the German submarine U-20. 30 minutes, two torpedoes and 1,198 deaths later the previously neutral USA was set on an irrevocable course to becoming embroiled in the "war to end all wars".

One good thing to come out of this tragedy - Winsor McCay's (and the world's) first animated documentary and at the time the longest animated film ever made:

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Gilgamesh of Uruk
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 07 May 2014, 16:19

@PaulRyckier wrote:


I was in Nîmes...beautiful Roman city...although many "Maghreb" nowadays along the road... here in Belgium I lived once along the remains of an old Roman road...

Kind regards and with esteem,

Paul.
Paul :
I too used (twice, actually) live alongside an old Roman Road - the Watling Street. We used to have 4 or 5 Ordnance Survey maps# on the wall in the Prefects Common Room at school for reference for those taking part in Duke of Edinburgh's Award hikes*. You could still plainly see the course of the Roman Roads on it - the courses of the Watling Street and Fosse Way formed a cross right across it.

# 1 inch = 1 mile, both measurements I understood even in those days.

*Highly recommended.
1) Hard to get lost going down Sabrina.
2) She helps you all the way.
3) Shooting rapids is more fun than climbing hills.
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Triceratops
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Thu 08 May 2014, 15:43

8 May 1945, Victory in Europe Day.

Crowds celebrate VE Day throughout the Allied nations. But in Halifax, Nova Scotia, they turn into a full scale riot;

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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Thu 08 May 2014, 21:27

@Gilgamesh of Uruk wrote:
@PaulRyckier wrote:


I was in Nîmes...beautiful Roman city...although many "Maghreb" nowadays along the road... here in Belgium I lived once along the remains of an old Roman road...

Kind regards and with esteem,

Paul.
Paul :
I too used (twice, actually) live alongside an old Roman Road - the Watling Street. We used to have 4 or 5 Ordnance Survey maps# on the wall in the Prefects Common Room at school for reference for those taking part in Duke of Edinburgh's Award hikes*. You could still plainly see the course of the Roman Roads on it - the courses of the Watling Street and Fosse Way formed a cross right across it.

# 1 inch = 1 mile, both measurements I understood even in those days.

*Highly recommended.
1) Hard to get lost going down Sabrina.
2) She helps you all the way.
3) Shooting rapids is more fun than climbing hills.


Gilgamesh, my old friend from Uruk,

never heard from this junction, but found this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watling_Street
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fosse_Way
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Cross,_Leicestershire
http://www.roman-britain.org/places/venonis.htm



Did also some research for "my" Roman road, but it isn't so well described as yours...
From the few resources I found the crossing have had to be at Kruishoutem and I heard when I lived in the neighbourhood about  archaeological rests found in Bachte Maria Leerne, but I found nothing about that on internet yesterday...
http://crea.ulb.ac.be/images/Carte-GB/Gallia-Belgica-II-CS5.ai
If you look on the map, it is the crossing of the Roman road Boulogne-Tongeren-Köln with the Roman road Oudenburg-Bavay in the territory of the Menapii...and the crossing of the two roads was near the crossing of the river Lys..

Another map which let the crossing more to the South and in the middle between the Lys and the Schelde and is more to the location of Kruishoutem...one had to say that many "tracés" of the Roman roads are not sure, while there is too less archaeological evidence of the exact tracé...


[url=http://books.google.be/books?id=Xul5nQp3rv8C&pg=PA89&lpg=PA89&dq="bavay+blicquy+oudenburg&source=bl&ots=SSZPyBvSBG&sig=p3Q8lVqXNvp6puODDKUEn-RVi4Y&hl=nl&sa=X&ei=X6pqU-bIDIGFO7GmgYgE&ved=0CDgQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q="bavay blicquy]http://books.google.be/books?id=Xul5nQp3rv8C&pg=PA89&lpg=PA89&dq=%22bavay+blicquy+oudenburg&source=bl&ots=SSZPyBvSBG&sig=p3Q8lVqXNvp6puODDKUEn-RVi4Y&hl=nl&sa=X&ei=X6pqU-bIDIGFO7GmgYgE&ved=0CDgQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=%22bavay%20blicquy%20oudenburg&f=false[/url]


From what I see now on the map I think that we lived closer to the Roman road Oudenburg-Bavay...

If you look at the map of Europe how dense the Roman road network was...it is not surprizing that on the about 17 active members of this small group already three live in the neighbourhood of a Roman road Wink ...


"# 1 inch = 1 mile, both measurements I understood even in those days."
That I understand...

"reference for those taking part in Duke of Edinburgh's Award hikes*.
*Highly recommended.
1) Hard to get lost going down Sabrina.
2) She helps you all the way.
3) Shooting rapids is more fun than climbing hills."

Gil, for me the Belgian continental that's Latin (that's Latin...expression to mean: not understandable...don't know the expression in English...)
But that Sabrina intrigues me...perhaps for the Anglo-Saxon readers it is all obvious...and then even more intriguing...in connection with Sabrina: shooting rapids is more fun than climbing hills...what has a man like me all to think about that...

Kind regards and with esteem from your friend,

Paul.
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Thu 08 May 2014, 21:30

Triceratops,

never heard about it. Did some quick research about it and as ever Wiki...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halifax_Riot

Kind regards and with esteem,

Paul.
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Gilgamesh of Uruk
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Thu 08 May 2014, 23:10

Sabrina - River Severn, Paul. Latin name for the river and its tutelary deity.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dancing-With-Sabrina-Journey-Severn/dp/1903070244
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Fri 09 May 2014, 08:09

that's Latin...expression to mean: not understandable...don't know the expression in English...

"It's all Greek to me" is the usual English expression, Paul.  Cheers, Caro.
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Fri 09 May 2014, 13:09

May 9th 1944 - Jimmie Davis is elected Governor of his native Louisiana for what was to be the first of two non-consecutive terms, the second coming in the 1960s when Davis's staunch anti-integration stance, as well as his controversial backing for projects such as the building of a new governor's mansion and the Toledo Bend Reservoir distanced him from many of the state electorate. History has forgiven him for many of his once unpopular political crusades (though maybe not his position on integration).

However has history forgiven him for this little ditty that he wrote in his previous life as a country music singer and one-time yodelling teacher?

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Triceratops
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Fri 09 May 2014, 13:11

@PaulRyckier wrote:
Triceratops,

never heard about it. Did some quick research about it and as ever Wiki...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halifax_Riot

Kind regards and with esteem,

Paul.


Paul, 9 May 1918, an event which took place in Belgium; (wiki again)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Ostend_Raid
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Fri 09 May 2014, 14:07

May 9th 2013 - this man is given a six year contract as manager of a certain football team ...


DOH!!!!
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Fri 09 May 2014, 17:09

@nordmann wrote:
May 9th 1944 - Jimmie Davis is elected Governor of his native Louisiana for what was to be the first of two non-consecutive terms, the second coming in the 1960s when Davis's staunch anti-integration stance, as well as his controversial backing for projects such as the building of a new governor's mansion and the Toledo Bend Reservoir distanced him from many of the state electorate. History has forgiven him for many of his once unpopular political crusades (though maybe not his position on integration).

However has history forgiven him for this little ditty that he wrote in his previous life as a country music singer and one-time yodelling teacher?

There are many worse (many,many, much, much worse) country "songs". I like this take on the genre.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CT5NZd3ZiU
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Fri 09 May 2014, 22:07

Most of these This Day in History are nationally or internationally important; this one is completely personal.

On May 9th, 1954, my mother wrote a chatty happy letter to her best friend.  She was in the maternity hospital about 15 minutes from where she lived.  It was ten days since the birth of her still-born child, who had encephalitis, and she was now allowed to get out of bed for the first time.  So she did and an aneuryrism went to her brain or lung and she collapsed and died. There was some difficulty finding my father - he was probably out on the farm - and when they did he got the message wrong somehow and thought she had been taken to the general hospital in Invercargill, about 20 minutes from the hospital, so she was dead by the time he got there.  It was Mother's Day and for many years a parcel sat in one of our cupboards from my sister and me (aged 4 and 3), saying To Dear Mummy with Love From Carolyn and Diane.

My grandmother came to look after us - she had been on her one and only trip back to Scotland when this happened, but I don't know if she came back early or not.  She used to tell us that when she left my mother was the only one of her daughters-in-law to see her off at the airport, and when she returned she was the only one not there. Which was a very sentimental thought to me.

At a reunion once of the maternity hospital I heard that one of the speech-makers proudly said they had only ever lost one mother at the home. 

Completely by chance (I had forgotten it was 60 years ago) we happened to be down at my sister's in the area yesterday and we went to the cemetery.  Next year it will be 50 years since my father died.  These dates make these events sound a very long time ago.
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Sat 10 May 2014, 13:41

@Gilgamesh of Uruk wrote:
Sabrina - River Severn, Paul. Latin name for the river and its tutelary deity.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dancing-With-Sabrina-Journey-Severn/dp/1903070244


Gil, Gil, if you only ever could imagine what I made from it... Embarassed ...Something like the interpretation of the "allusions" (French: allusion) of a French comedy... Wink ...

Kind regards from your "allusion" receptive Paul.
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Sat 10 May 2014, 13:56

@Caro wrote:
that's Latin...expression to mean: not understandable...don't know the expression in English...

"It's all Greek to me" is the usual English expression, Paul.  Cheers, Caro.


Caro,

thanks for the help. did some research about the expression:
http://www.omniglot.com/language/idioms/incomprehensible.php
It seems that most languages mention "Chinese"
What is intriguing to me that some languages call something not understandable: "Spanish village"...and of course smiling about the "double Dutch"...that from the time of the rivalry between the Dutch and the Brits...the Brits not wanting to agree that they learned it all from the Dutch...

And read about your sad anniversary...I feel with you...Some rememberings of the childhood remain engraved in your memory...for me it was the move to Ostend from near Ghent when I was three years old...see still the aluminium cooking kettles in one corner of the kitchen...my sister who burned her neck against the hot metal of the Louvain stove...I sitting in my uncle's camion with the long nose...

Kind regards and with esteem,

Paul.
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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Sat 10 May 2014, 15:48

@Triceratops wrote:
@PaulRyckier wrote:
Triceratops,

never heard about it. Did some quick research about it and as ever Wiki...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halifax_Riot

Kind regards and with esteem,

Paul.


Paul, 9 May 1918, an event which took place in Belgium; (wiki again)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Ostend_Raid


Triceratops,

yes, when I lived near Ostend I passed every day near the bow of the Vindictive put between the two bridges of the link between the harbour and the canal Ostend-Bruges. Now the road is closed for traffic, only busses...as there is a new road (some two miles longer) for the traffic to the East coast...
https://www.google.be/maps/place/Oostende/@51.2238167,2.9317084,15z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x47dca8d31895a595:0x3e97dbf009839842

Thanks for remembering me about the event.

Kind regards and with esteem,

Paul.
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Gilgamesh of Uruk
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Sun 11 May 2014, 23:55

Almost too late with this (been out all day)

11th May 1812 - the only British PM to be assassinated - Spencer Perceval - was killed in the lobby of the Commons. Apparently, recent renovations have led to the obliteration of the "break" in the pattern which marked the spot.

see http://www.eastmidlandsnews.org.uk/news/tribute-to-northamptons-former-prime-minster-spencer-perceval-removed-by-workman
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Caro
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Mon 12 May 2014, 02:23

I'm far too late with this, but the list in Saturday's paper (10th May) interested me, because of events that just don't last in the public memory.  Both NZ items:

1834: After the barque Harriet run aground at Cape Egmont, survivors are attacked by Ngati Ruanui Maori and twelve sailors are captured and eaten.  Other cases of cannibalism are relatively well known but I have never heard about these sailors. Ah, but when I check this more, I see this story is known in a different form.  The references to it always talk about Betty Guard the wife of the captain who was captured and waited under Maori protection for four months till her husband, allowed to go for help, returned with 60 soldiers, the first British troops to come into armed conflict with Maori.  Maori expected negotiations but instead the chief was killed, and there was condemnation from the British House of Commons about the level of violence used. The sailors killed are never part of the main narrative of this.

And in 1862: a large crowd packed a public meeting in Dunedin to consider self-governance for the South Island.  This has not yet eventuated though even now and again people irritated by a lack of government concern for down south mutter about such a possibility.  It's never taken seriously now. Feisty Scottish people wanting independence again, I suppose. At the time Dunedin was the wealthiest area of NZ due to the gold rushes, but the seat of government was in Auckland. This was shifted to Wellington soon after, in some part for reconciliation.  But the movement seemed driven by the local newspaper, edited by a political figure who later was Premier for several years and brought in a huge programme of building infrastructure.
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 13 May 2014, 09:23

Monday, 13th May, 1935.

T. E. Shaw, aka Lawrence of Arabia, pottered about in his little cottage in Dorset. Sometime during the morning he decided to nip on his motorcycle to the Post Office at Wool, the village just outside Bovington Camp. He wanted to send a parcel of books to a friend; he also sent a telegram to Henry Williamson (the author of Tarka the Otter): Lunch Tuesday wet fine. Cottage one mile north Bovington Camp - Shaw.

There was no mystery about the telegram (as some have suggested); the "wet fine" simply meant, "Come for lunch on Tuesday, whatever the weather" - a very sensible thing to say in England.

Having completed his errands, Lawrence got back on his bike and set off to return home.

The rest is history. Lawrence did not die immediately, but lingered for six more days. Had he survived (thank goodness he did not) he would probably have been without sight -  and paralysed.



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Gilgamesh of Uruk
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 13 May 2014, 12:12

@PaulRyckier wrote:
@Gilgamesh of Uruk wrote:
Sabrina - River Severn, Paul. Latin name for the river and its tutelary deity.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dancing-With-Sabrina-Journey-Severn/dp/1903070244


Gil, Gil, if you only ever could imagine what I made from it... Embarassed ...Something like the interpretation of the "allusions" (French: allusion) of a French comedy... Wink ...

Kind regards from your "allusion" receptive Paul.


Paul

There is another saying in English with which you may be unfamiliar - "to have one's leg pulled". This does not mean literally grasping someone by the lower limb and applying a force to it- IIRC our Walloon friends would have said "faire marcher (quelqu'un)"

You may enjoy the following use of "All Greek to me" from Christopher Fry's "The Lady's not for Burning"

I know I am not
A practical person; legal matters and so forth
Are Greek to me; except of course
That I understand Greek. And what may seem nonsensical
To men of affairs like yourselves might not seem so
To me, since everything astonishes me,
Myself most of all. When I think of myself
I can scarcely believe my senses. But there it is,
All my friends tell me I actually exist
And by an act of faith I have come to believe them.
But this fellow who is being such a trouble to us
He, on the contrary, is so convinced
He is that he wishes he were not. Now why
Should that be?

BTW - if you have ever heard Maggie's "the lady's not for turning", do you agree with the contention that it showed she had no idea where the quote came from, folks?
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nordmann
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 13 May 2014, 12:54

Just to demonstrate how internationally aware Australia was in the 1870s - this American news item was included in the Saturday, May 13th, 1876 edition of the Sydney Morning Herald:

“An intelligent black boy was trudging along a highway at night in the vicinity of Palestine, Texas, behind a woman riding a horse. He said he saw a ball of fire come out of the sky and strike the woman and set her ablaze. The horse ran away with the woman afire on his back, and the boy ran back to town, out of breath and pale as he could get. The woman died the next day. The people think she was hit by a meteor.”

Mind you, perhaps we have not progressed that much in the intervening 137 years. That yardstick of woo woo "The Fortean Times" poo poos the whole meteor theory, not as you might expect for the obvious reasons that a large chunk of rock travelling at several thousand miles an hour was hardly going to be satisified with simply singeing its unfortunate victim and in any case would by then have been a meteorite not a meteor, but because - the Forteans inform us - this was so obviously a typical case of a sentient fireball. Where are intelligent black boys when you need them?
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Gilgamesh of Uruk
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 13 May 2014, 13:18

@nordmann wrote:
Where are intelligent black boys when you need them?
Still running away in case they get the blame, I suspect.
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Meles meles
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 13 May 2014, 13:47

@nordmann wrote:
..... the whole meteor theory, not as you might expect for the obvious reasons that a large chunk of rock travelling at several thousand miles an hour was hardly going to be satisified with simply singeing its unfortunate victim ..

Okay clever-clogs ... so if it weren't a meteor, then what was it? Ball lightning? St Elmo's Fire? Sparks carried in updraughts from a distant bonfire? Or did someone just lob an over-cooked, burning sweet-potato from off the bbq?

Or was it yet again just that selfish vengeful god, Yahweh, smiting a disciple of the Texan branch of the Southern Baptist Protestant Christian Church, 'cos on a whim that week he was favouring Menonites of Arkansas?!?

But leaving aside my mocking satire ... I'm still intrigued as to the accepted best explanation of the event?


Last edited by Meles meles on Tue 13 May 2014, 14:03; edited 1 time in total
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 13 May 2014, 14:02

What happened to the poor horse?
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Meles meles
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 13 May 2014, 14:06

@Temperance wrote:
What happened to the poor horse?

Probably got made into black pudding ..... yum, yum!  Shocked 

But at least the black lad seems to have got away scott free!
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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 13 May 2014, 22:04

Gil,

"There is another saying in English with which you may be unfamiliar - "to have one's leg pulled". This does not mean literally grasping someone by the lower limb and applying a force to it- IIRC our Walloon friends would have said "faire marcher (quelqu'un)""

For once  Wink I knew that expression: "to have one's leg pulled"...in fact in our Flemish dialect we say the same as in the French "faire marcher quelqu'un": "iemand doen gaan" (someone do? (make) march)... I couldn't think, as I am so used to that expression, how it was in Dutch...I had to take a French-Dutch dictionary to find out that it was: "iemand beetnemen (make a fool of), iemand in het ootje nemen (pull someone's leg)"
Did some research for the Dutch "in het ootje nemen"
https://onzetaal.nl/taaladvies/advies/in-het-ootje-nemen
And found in this article even some two other expressions for the same idiom:
"in de maling nemen" which is more typical Dutch (but I knew the expression)
and:
"voor het lapje houden" (which we use also in our dialect, now that I see it in the text)

Now back to the supposed girl that I thought you met when you was a teenager...
http://www.whitedragon.org.uk/articles/sabrina.htm

And to be honest you seem always to make some difficult to interpret paragraphs for me...as when I once years ago asked to you about the "augurs" and you explained it with your chickens...(BTW: Have you still your chickens?)

Allez:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_lady's_not_for_turning
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lady%27s_Not_for_Burning

Gil, the least I can say about you...that I always learn something with you...

Kind regards from your friend,

Paul.
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Gilgamesh of Uruk
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Tue 13 May 2014, 23:30

Paul - yes, we still have chickens (probably not the same ones), and we now have ducks as well - Aylesburys and Muscovys. Aylesbury ducks are plain white were originally bred in the town of Aylesbury and its surrounding area mostly for meat, but Muscovy ducks come from South America - the usual English grasp of world geography is once more on display! (IIRC they were first imported by the Muscovy Company)
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LadyinRetirement
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 14 May 2014, 10:43

There are a wealth of meanings for IIRC, Gilgamesh, according to this link.  An acquaintance of mine dug out a duck pond and some ducks from a few doors down decided they liked her pond better than there own - but they were returned to their "owners".

http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/IIRC
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nordmann
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 14 May 2014, 10:53

May 14th, 1796 this little scene plays out in a kitchen near Doctor Jenner;



or this one ...



or even this one (not everyone at the time was convinced he was up to any good) ...





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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 14 May 2014, 11:57

14th May 1756 stands out as a dark day in the long annals of British atrocities carried out in the name of empire and which curiously have never featured that much in the average British child's history curriculum. In this case the target was the local Mi'kmak nation in what Britain referred to as Nova Scotia but which the indigenous Mi'kmak referred to as "home".

General Lawrence, governor of Nova Scotia and acting on the instruction of his superior, General Cornwallis, issued the following proclamation;



The scalping reward was raised six months later to fifty guineas and the proclamation widened to include the scalps of Frenchmen. When news later filtered back of French being murdered in this state-sponsored incitement of the colonials to commit genocide some unease and protest developed in Britain concerning what Cornwallis was up to. By the time this had any effect however the Mi'kmak were a vanquished race.
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 14 May 2014, 12:08

First time I've heard of that one. I have heard of the British issuing smallpox infected blankets to North American tribes, but that is the first I've seen of an official proclamation encouraging scalping.
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 14 May 2014, 12:22

Believe it or not that proclamation has never been repealed. The modern Mi'kmak chiefs have been campaigning for twenty years now at state legislature level for the present Canadian government to do so but the issue is "complicated" by the fact that it is tied up with land reclamation issues as well as constitutional problems with laws passed under the old pre-commonwealth system neither of which the British Canadian government really wants to have to deal with (the French of course are more amenable on both issues).

At the time the proclamation was issued Cornwallis favoured this genocidal approach with the whole colonial population being encouraged to take part, as to openly declare war on the Mi'kmak, he knew, would be to tacitly acknowledge their right to be seen as a nation.

Here's a typical example of what these "savages" are up to at the moment.

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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 14 May 2014, 21:51

@Gilgamesh of Uruk wrote:
Paul - yes, we still have chickens (probably not the same ones), and we now have ducks as well - Aylesburys and Muscovys. Aylesbury ducks are plain white were originally bred in the town of Aylesbury and its surrounding area mostly for meat, but Muscovy ducks come from South America - the usual English grasp of world geography is once more on display! (IIRC they were first imported by the Muscovy Company)


Gil,

have some mixed remembrances about ducks...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscovy_duck
In our dialect we called it "Barbarieten" and I see in the Wiki also the term "Barbary duck"...
Two times in my life we received as present a "self raised?" duck...and I, the city boy, used to the dry and automated stuff concerning duck, couldn't eat it as it was that fat...and perhaps due to the feeding some "marsh taste" (I see that the Dutch "moeras" also exists in English but in another context)...
And don't laugh...we had also chickens. And once, as my parents were fish merchants, we gave them some heads of cod fish...but we had to stop it as after a while the eggs had all a fish taste...we had also fresh milk from the neighbour farmer...and in the winter when feeding the cows with the acid ensiled feed, the milk had a specific taste that I didn't like...and my mother had to cook the milk and then on top of the milk you had a fatty skin that I didn't liked too...and the milk underneath was watered down...no, no give me the chemical treated pasteurized carton bricks anytime...
But I don't want nevertheless in any circumstances to downplay the "quality" of "your" ducks...



Aylesbury ducks...
Other remembrances...
Our company had a factory at Aylesbury...was three times overthere...not a big city in my humble opinion...
An older man was our connection overthere...and many times he came to us in Belgium...overtime I got used to his dialect..."it's a nice day to die today" (it's a nice die to die todie)...had to translate it into English in confrontation with our Belgian secretary...but a nice guy it was, which I learned to appreciate a lot over the years...a real English man, without "menselijk opzicht" (I didn't find any translation on the internet, neither in my Dutch-English dictionary, in my Dutch-French one I found "par crainte du jugement des hommes" (for fear of the opinion of people): "human perspective"? "fear of people's opinion"?))...
when he arrived in winter headed with a "Sherlock Holmes" hat...you could imagine what disturbance he made among the Belgian public...

Kind regards, Paul.
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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Wed 14 May 2014, 22:07

Nordmann,

after all those years you know me...a bit of an American...it has all to be explicitly explained in not to difficult terms and in a not to difficult to grasp form...
After the third image...and as I saw the text: cow pox and inoculation...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inoculation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Jenner


Kind regards and with esteem,

Paul.
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Thu 15 May 2014, 14:35

May 15th 1793

Diego Marin Aguilera, local inventor and amateur scientist, drags the contraption that he and the local blacksmith have built to the highest point of the castle in Coruña del Conde, Spain. Night has fallen - Diego is all too aware that many of his fellow villagers are deeply suspicious of his latest invention, a glider with which he hopes to emulate the flight of eagles, and the cover of darkness will keep unwanted prying eyes from witnessing this audacious attempt to defy god's will.



Leaping from the parapet Diego and his machine glide under a full moon across the river Arandilla, a distance those invited to attend claimed afterwards was around 300 metres in total, before a weld in the structure snaps and he crashes heavily in a field by the far riverbank. Diego receives some small cuts and bruises but is otherwise unharmed, having performed what is most probably the first ever intentional flight by man and machine in history.

The villagers are not impressed however. When they hear of what he has done they storm his workshop the next day and set fire to his glider. Diego, dispirited, never again attempts to fly and dies six years later, still only 44 years old.
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ferval
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Thu 15 May 2014, 15:07

Huh, that's nothing. In 1507 John Damian may have covered about half a mile after leaping from the battlements of Stirling Castle wearing wings furnished with chicken feathers. He landed in a dung heap with a broken leg but such a minor injury following the descent from the walls and down the castle rock suggests he achieved at least some success, even if he didn't make France which was his goal.
He attributed his failure to the choice of chickens rather than more efficient flyers to supply the feathers.

http://martinfrost.ws/htmlfiles/scotnews08/080908_fly.html
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PostSubject: Re: On this day in history Round One   Thu 15 May 2014, 17:12

Paul :
I think the nearest English equivalent to your phrases might be "down to earth".
Two things we discovered one should not feed to laying hens : Beetroot (Beta vulgaris) which turns the white pink, and Shepherd's purse (Capsella bursa-pastoris) which turns the yolk, or specific layers of it green.
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